http://educate-yourself.org/lte/ltejakaskeptictobeliever14sep02.shtml
Sept. 14, 2002

 ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Jaka Pavloviè" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
 To: <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
 Sent: Tuesday, September 10, 2002 6:48 AM
 Subject: Contraception and birth control with CS

Contraception and birth control with CS

Collodial silver kills spermatozoon too.  So if you take CS frequently with CS in your body you become totaly sterile.
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
To: "Jaka Pavloviè" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
Sent: Tuesday, September 10, 2002 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS

"Collodial silver kills spermatozoon too."
 
Really? Based on what documented evidence and authored by whom?
 
Ken
 

 ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Jaka Pavlovic" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
 To: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
 Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 12:50 AM
 Subject: Odg: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS
 
Dear Ken

On the same documents that unequivocally documented 650 extermination of diferent virus, germs and bacteria.

Jaka
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
To: "Jaka Pavlovic" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 3:18 AM
Subject: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS

Hi Jaka,
 
Human sperm are not considered pathogens. The 650 refers to disease organisms. The tests were done at UCLA.
 
 Sincerely, Ken
 
 ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Jaka Pavlovic" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
 To: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
 Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 4:23 AM
 Subject: Odg: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS
 
Quotation:

Test results at the UCLA Medical Labs at the UCLA School of Medicine in 1988 by Larry C. Ford, M.D and other researchers show Colloidal Silver killed every virus on which it was tested. They found that Colloidal Silver acts as a catalyst and disables the enzyme used to metabolize oxygen, causing all one-celled microorganisms to die. Because organisms cannot build an immunity to Colloidal Silver, their mutations are just as vulnerable to
Colloidal Silver's rapid action. Because Colloidal Silver is neutralized by body acids in the stomach, the compound doesn't usually kill "friendly bacteria" unless too much is ingested. Colloidal Silver is the only silver that can be safely used as a supplement because of its bio-availability and slow rate of absorption.

Question: -  If Colloidal Silver is neutralized by body acids in the stomach how it can act against patogene bacteria (Candida Albicans etc) in digestive tract (colon ..) and human body ?????????

- Spermatozoons are one-celled microorganisms too, so ...
 

 ----- Original Message -----
From: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
To: "Jaka Pavlovic" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 8:27 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS

 Dear Jaka,
 
 A few things are clear to me about you:
 
 1. You don't know anything about colloidal silver and YOU DON'T WANT TO KNOW anything about colloidal silver. You prefer to be a skeptic or critic and argue for the sake of ego gratification by attempting to win points in a debate. Debate yourself.. I have no interest in it.
 
 It' s not my responsibility to convince you of the merits of CS. Whether you approve or don't approve of CS; whether you use it or don't use it; whether  you're skeptical or not; it's your problem, not mine. Bother someone else with your skepticism. If you want to learn about colloidal silver, buy a few books and do your own studying.
 
 2. Don't ask me to defend the words of another author. These are not my words. Find the author of this article and send him your questions. The statement you refer to is partially incorrect, but it's not my responsibility to address it or defend it. Ask the author, not me.
 
 3. I know of no biology text that classifies spermatozoa as ''micro-organisms". We usually reserve the term for free living or parasitic creatures that invade a host; not native tissue produced by the host's body.
 
 Jaka, you're really not qualified to play the role of critic. The caliber of your questions makes that obvious. Why don't you remove the critic's hat and try being a student for a change. Perhaps your questions (and knowledge base) will improve.
 
 Sincerely, Ken
 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jaka Pavlovic" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
To: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 3:56 AM
Subject: Odg: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS

"The tests were done at UCLA".

But not documented at all.

Did you ever read this:

COLLOIDAL SILVER

No one has ever proven any benefit in taking colloidal  silver by mouth. There are no human studies on what it will  or won't do for you or against any disease, no mater who  manufactures it.  The following is posted with the  permission of the author, Tom Grier who performed his own  research on colloidal silver much like I did, with almost  the same results.

"The latest of these alternative treatments that has taken  hold of the Lyme community has been liquid suspensions of  Colloidal Silver. Colloidal Silver is simply  a suspension  of silver metal particles so small, that they stay in  suspension by  simple brownian motion. Several companies  manufacture and distribute Colloidal Silver products as  food supplements, which means they are not regulated by the  FDA. Silver is in fact an essential trace element that our  bodies require in minute quantities. Most of the silver we  get from our diet however is in the ionic form (the silver  atom carries a positive charge) such as from a silver salt,  or a silver oxide, and not the metallic form of silver that  is found in the Colloidal Silver preparations being sold.  Since the FDA does not regulate these Colloidal Silver  products, the manufacturers do not have to provide any  proof of safety or efficacy. They need only satisfy the FTC requirement, that the contents of the bottle are clearly  labeled, and verifiable.

 I was greatly intrigued by the literature that accompanied  these products. Almost all of the distributors had the same  things to say about Colloidal Silver, and most used the  same references repeatedly for their facts. Noticeably  absent however, were any controlled multi subject studies on humans. After I looked up some of the references and  read them for my self, I felt that some had been greatly  misrepresented, misquoted, and eronius conclusions had been  drawn....."

[Editor's Note: This is a long debunking aritlce, but I urge you to read it in its entirety. The complete article is found here:  http://www.lymealliance.org/research/grier/grier_8.php ]
 
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Editor
To: Jaka Pavlovic
Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2002 4:23 AM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS

Hello Jaka,

See below:

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jaka Pavlovi?" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
To: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2002 3:56 AM
Subject: Odg: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS
 

>
> "The tests were done at UCLA".But not documented at all.

Really? How do you know? What do you really know of the circumstances surrounding that study and whether it was 'documented' or not ?

I happen to know the details of that study intimately and you, my friend, do not know what you are talking about. Is your knowledge base exclusively limited to the word of drug company shills and propagandist like Tom Grier, who you quote below?

> Did you ever read this:

No,  not before today , but after looking up ole Tom's web site on a search engine, I see that he has a LOTS OF THINGS  to say about MANY natural therapies. For instance, Tom warns his readers that his laundry list of  "worthless treatments" include:

1. Rife machines,
2. ozone,
3. hydrogen peroxide,
4. Homeopathy
5. Magnet therapy,
6. Aroma therapy,
7. Herbal Oils and supplements,
8. Crystal therapy,
9. Collostrum,
10. Colloidal silver,
11. Electro-magnetic therapy,
12. Dark field microscoscopy

From: Cures, Promises, and Snake Oil: False Hopes in a Bottle
http://www.lymealliance.org/research/grier/grier_9.php

Tom Grier is very much in the mold of another professional debunker, Stephen Barrett [ http://www.quackwatch.com ], although certainly more slick. Tom's attack list is not quite as encyclopedic as Stephen Barrett's, but he does well enough.

Tom wants his readers to believe that he's an even-minded sort of guy and if the reader THINKS that some alternative therapy MIGHT work, Tom says that person CERTAINLY ought to have the right to try it if he wants to. That sure is magnanimous of him isn't it? But, of course, that doesn't stop him from throwing around the "quack" word quite a bit  and "snake oil salesmen"', along with "worthless" and "scam", every few lines. Think maybe he has an agenda Jaka?

By the way, Tom tells us in another of his many essays on the potential harm that can be caused by natural therapies, that megadoses of Vitamin C MIGHT be detrimental and even exasterbate the symptoms and SPEED the progression of  patients with neurological Lyme disease! Good Lord.

He quotes 3 cases to establish his thesis, but pulls his punches by asking the reader rhetorical questions at the end of his indictments, like:

 " Did this person make his neurological Lyme disease worse with vitamin C? Did  vitamin C inhibit the success of later treatment with antibiotics? Without a good animal study, it is impossible to know for sure. "

 That's the slick part I was referring to.

In the same article linked above, Tom warns his readers of the foolishness of being taken in by other alternative medicine promotion schemes such as Dark Field Microscopy.  Specifically,  Tom wants us to be weary of  people who promote the use of "Magic microscopes" . Tom's referring to dark field microscopy, but seems to prefer to highlight the term "Magic microscope"  I guess it fits his style better (or should I say agenda?) .

 Anyway, Tom wants us to know that this circus act to 'trick' people into believing that there is something worthwhile in the use of the "Magic microscope"  is just so much nonsense. In fact, Tom states-flat out-that the microbes and disease organisms exposed through the use of live, dark field microscopy, are in fact, the patient's own blood mixed with (and I quote directly)

" a drop of swamp water or other contaminant"

 that is serrupticiously slipped into the blood slide by the operator using an " innocent looking bottle of microscope immersion fluid" !!!.

Can you imagine that! Pond scum slipped onto the slide to deceive the person into believing that those bugs were in his blood stream! Boy oh boy, you sure can't fool ole Tom Grier. He's right on top of those dark field microscope "quacks" , isn't he?
 

So this is the man you are quoting to "prove" the worthlessness of colloidal silver?

Well I suppose I could spend more time on Tom's other 'explanations', obfuscations and distortions, but I think you get the idea.

Jaka, if you're gong to look to pro-orhodox shills like Grier or Bassett to "prove" your point, you're always going to come up with a negative conclusion. If you prefer the words of liars and deceptionists rather than investigate the matter thoroughly with an open mind and with a sincere interest in discovering the truth of the matter, you'll always find this sort of skewed 'proof', but it's pharmaceutical /orthodox medicine debunking propaganda, plain and simple.

Read their lies and believe their lies if you wish Jaka. They have many more laying in wait for you.

Saionara, Ken
 

 ----- Original Message -----
From: "Jaka Pavlovi?" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
To: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2002 6:36 AM
Subject: Odg: Re: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS
 
Kon-nichiwa, Ken

I'm pleasant surprised at your exciting explanation. Perhaps I was asking right for it! Certainly I read your interesting articles at "Educate yourself" too.

Arigato gozaimasu.

Sayounara

Jaka

---- Original Message -----
From: "Editor" <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
To: "Jaka Pavlovi?" <Jaka.Pavlovic@gov.si>
Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 2:11 AM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Contraception and birth control with CS

Thanks Jaka. Glad you took it the right  way.
 
Kind Regards, Ken